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Post by blueraider1 on Jun 30, 2006 7:33:33 GMT -5
we'll never know about that.  |
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Post by gatekeeper on Jun 30, 2006 9:39:57 GMT -5
Hey Gray, you could always just change the stats on the back. If that's what he needs to try to make his game more fun for him...he should go for it. You act like he's changing the original Declaration of Independence or something. Basically, yeah. Changing stats is unheard of for people who play this game. It's a slap in the face to Tom as far as I'm concerned. He's been making this game since 1987. I think he knows what he's doing. The minute you alter a card's stats, why bother using him? Because then you're not really using a guy that Tom created. You're using your watered down version. But, with wrestling fans, everyone thinks they know everything. |
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Post by gatekeeper on Jun 30, 2006 9:42:20 GMT -5
Is this always how you and Gatekeeper make your points? Are you two ten years old or something??? As recently as this week I praised Tom highly more than once about the game and the upcoming edition. If you're going to rag on somebody like you're back in grade school, at least get your facts straight...it will keep your foot out of your mouth. You've already said this exact thing in an earlier post. If you're new to this board, these kind of things don't make DR or myself go, "Yeah, he's right." The "grade school" thing =  |
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Post by Tournament Master on Jun 30, 2006 10:00:31 GMT -5
I definately agree that the updates in cards has been following the evolved style of wrestling. Good point there PH.
As far as changing card backs, I would never do it (infact I am kicking myself for writing Commender Sam's distractor rating on the back of his card when he first started managing). I don't understand why you would want to do it, but I don't think its an insult to Tom.
AsTom always says, "Its up to you Promoter".
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Post by Trent Lawless on Jun 30, 2006 10:15:15 GMT -5
Altering card stats is a sticky situation. I know there's the "It's up to you, promoter" school of thought, and that may work okay in isolated instances. But there's a limit to how much of that you can do (in my mind, a very low limit) before, like GK says, it becomes too different to be comparable to everything else that's current or in the past. Plus, never tell the Promoter people you're doing that or they'll have to disqualify your rankings!  |
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Post by swarm on Jun 30, 2006 10:30:24 GMT -5
I don't think enough people understand that all these guys are designed the way they are for a reason...
I know for a fact that there are two guys in 2121 who are specifically designed to fight each other...
What Tom does is a science...
If you think he just slaps a bunch of moves on a card, gives it some chart choices, a finisher, like 99,9% of all bootlegs out there, you couldn't be more wrong.
I really get the impression a lot of people do not understand even the most basic mechanics of this game, and I'm positive anyone who changes the stats on the cards does not know how to follow and understand all the rules of the COTG game card.
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Post by jefft on Jun 30, 2006 12:48:47 GMT -5
If that's what he needs to try to make his game more fun for him...he should go for it. You act like he's changing the original Declaration of Independence or something. Basically, yeah. Changing stats is unheard of for people who play this game. It's a slap in the face to Tom as far as I'm concerned. He's been making this game since 1987. I think he knows what he's doing. The minute you alter a card's stats, why bother using him? Because then you're not really using a guy that Tom created. You're using your watered down version. But, with wrestling fans, everyone thinks they know everything. - Errr, in 15 years of playing I've corresponded with 5-6 people who've changed stats for various reasons. That's probably out of the total of 10 or so that I've ever known to write back and forth with. None of them ever suggested anything of the kind. Off the top of my head here's all the 'face-slapping' I've done. In 2094 or so after Chaos had won 22 matches in a row, I decided the character was too powerful...I downgraded him slightly. In 2096, after a series of confrontations, Wolf permanently injured Bounty Hunter...he got a permanent downgrade. In 2098, when SW retired and Alpha Force having problems there was a serious vacuum of powerful faces, I gave Raven an upgrade. I'm sure there's been a couple others that don't come to mind right now. I'm REALLY (no sarcasm) trying to understand how my needing upgrades or downgrades for a few characters insults Tom or, for that matter, even suggests he doesn't know what he's doing. |
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Post by jefft on Jun 30, 2006 12:49:44 GMT -5
Is this always how you and Gatekeeper make your points? Are you two ten years old or something??? As recently as this week I praised Tom highly more than once about the game and the upcoming edition. If you're going to rag on somebody like you're back in grade school, at least get your facts straight...it will keep your foot out of your mouth. You've already said this exact thing in an earlier post. If you're new to this board, these kind of things don't make DR or myself go, "Yeah, he's right." The "grade school thing = Hey, I didn't start the personal sniping, dude. |
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Post by jefft on Jun 30, 2006 12:54:28 GMT -5
I don't think enough people understand that all these guys are designed the way they are for a reason... I know for a fact that there are two guys in 2121 who are specifically designed to fight each other... What Tom does is a science... If you think he just slaps a bunch of moves on a card, gives it some chart choices, a finisher, like 99,9% of all bootlegs out there, you couldn't be more wrong. I really get the impression a lot of people do not understand even the most basic mechanics of this game, and I'm positive anyone who changes the stats on the cards does not know how to follow and understand all the rules of the COTG game card. Please...educate me then as to how making my own personal upgrades and downgrades based on how things have occured in my own fed over long periods in any way conflicts with the points you just made. Really. Your last sentence is just...whatever...I won't get into it again. |
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Post by jefft on Jun 30, 2006 12:55:58 GMT -5
Plus, never tell the Promoter people you're doing that or they'll have to disqualify your rankings! Now that I can understand...I've never actually sent in rankings (see my promoter rankings question...I don't even remember how I'd do it). |
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Post by Joe on Jun 30, 2006 13:06:21 GMT -5
Altering a wrestler's stats, for the most part, is pretty pointless. If you don't like the card, don't use it.
The case with Chaos, where it was done because the individual promoter thought it was unfair that Chaos had three finishers, is absolutely ridiculous. The whole point of Chaos was for him to be a revolutionary character that was very hard to beat. By the same token, his main feuds were with a guy who had (-3) agility, (-2) power and a roll finisher; a guy who had (-3) power, (-2) agility and a (+4); and a guy that had all "A" ratings, (-4) agility, (-2) power and double (+5) roll finishers. He really wasn't that much better on paper than the people he was competing with.
Outside of using the retirement charts to reflect aging, stat-altering is makes no sense.
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Post by gamemaster on Jun 30, 2006 13:28:56 GMT -5
When I jumped from 2101 to 2119 and seen the difference in nearly the whole GWFs stats I was amazed. Then I played the year and really enjoyed the way on paper some guys looked the same but the standout stars were the same as Tom had laid out. The four cover wrestlers (Disaster, Endgame, Encubus, and Bloodline) really were the cream of the crop. Now do I agree with promoters changing their stats... I wouldn't do it but if it really makes you happy then go ahead. The only thing I think that is wrong is all the harping on Monolith being overpowered. Most of us have not even got the card yet and their is already talks of him being way overpowered. I for one hope it is true because its been far too long since a Chaos like character has run roughshod over the fed. 2119 and 2120's playing fields for the top stars are a little even right now so this should shake up everyones fed. I for one think that we all as a whole should at least try to use the new uber heel before you change him. Somebody else needs to come out with a C.O.T.G. knockoff again because thats the last time we all got along as a whole group.
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Post by gatekeeper on Jun 30, 2006 13:42:21 GMT -5
Somebody else needs to come out with a C.O.T.G. knockoff again because thats the last time we all got along as a whole group. You mean wrestling fans disagree??? No way. |
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Post by jefft on Jun 30, 2006 13:47:34 GMT -5
The case with Chaos, where it was done because the individual promoter thought it was unfair that Chaos had three finishers, is absolutely ridiculous. I don't agree with changing his finishers, but I wouldn't call it ridiculous if that is what made his fed more fun. Three finishers was always the coolest thing about Chaos though. |
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Post by gatekeeper on Jun 30, 2006 13:52:30 GMT -5
I don't agree with changing his finishers That's how you should feel about the rest of the card too. |
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Post by swarm on Jun 30, 2006 14:40:58 GMT -5
I don't think enough people understand that all these guys are designed the way they are for a reason... I know for a fact that there are two guys in 2121 who are specifically designed to fight each other... What Tom does is a science... If you think he just slaps a bunch of moves on a card, gives it some chart choices, a finisher, like 99,9% of all bootlegs out there, you couldn't be more wrong. I really get the impression a lot of people do not understand even the most basic mechanics of this game, and I'm positive anyone who changes the stats on the cards does not know how to follow and understand all the rules of the COTG game card. Please...educate me then as to how making my own personal upgrades and downgrades based on how things have occured in my own fed over long periods in any way conflicts with the points you just made. Really. Not even if I possesed the IQ of Mesmer, the life-span of Solaris, and the patience of Atman, would I be able to find the time it would take to "educate" you on why making your own personal upgrades and downgrades conflicts with the way Tom writes the game. |
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Post by Wildfire on Jun 30, 2006 15:06:49 GMT -5
I don't see how making your own upgrades or downgrades is any different from using bootlegs. I personally dont tweak cards, but I definately did a couple downgrades/upgrade to EC guys before EC came out... heck, they're prolly still around here some where. I think we can appreciate the time and effort that goes into the cards, yet try some things on our own as well. This is a business, in addition to a game, and it makes more sense to have more new characters than upgrades from a marketing point of view. There are definately a few guys through GWF history (Matador and Massif leap to mind) that really could ahve used updates of some sort, but never got them. I don't see any problem trying your own hand at it, especially since you can make it work with you own fed that way. As far as the card design, the groups are designed that way too, I don't see that much difference between this and, oh, turning Swarn heel and having him at the top of the card , instead of a mid card feud with Amazing Mann, for example. |
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Post by spiderbite on Jun 30, 2006 15:31:32 GMT -5
I still find it amazing how wrestlers and their success from one promoters fed to anothers
can be so different. ex. In 2089 Jefft had to upgrade Raven and Wildfire wanted to see the
Matador get an upgrade.
In my fed I was happy they didn't get upgraded, or downgraded for that matter. These were
2 of the greatest wrestlers ever in my fed. Raven had a great run w/ the GWF title I thought might not ever end and I threw every one at him. And Matador was tied w/ Thantos for most GWF titles won in their careers, that is until last year (2113) when Wolf surpassed that accomplishment (though one could argue he's wrestled longer than either Thantos or M83)
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Post by blueraider1 on Jun 30, 2006 15:33:54 GMT -5
matador is fine as is.haven't gotten to raven will in 2095.
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Post by spiderbite on Jun 30, 2006 15:54:19 GMT -5
I loved his character neilybob, but I'll leave it at that since you haven't got there yet.
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