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Post by dennish on Aug 7, 2005 12:09:22 GMT -5
I love the UFC, and I'm glad that SPIKE TV has brought the sport to cable. I'm watching the show from lastnight as I type. Josh Koscheck made the Secret Weapon tap-out with a choke-hold, 2-0 in the UFC for Koscheck. I love wrestling, but the UFC is real and it draws my attention for most of the time, it all depends on if it is a slow dragged out fight or a lets put it all on the line fight. GREAT STUFF!
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Post by Darth Turkish on Aug 7, 2005 19:16:09 GMT -5
It was a pretty good show, most of the fights predictable. a few things I did not like were:
Patrick Cote was robbed. He should have had the decision over Leben.
The Quarry match was ended too soon. His opponent took that shot to the chin hard (as well as the following shot on the ground), but I wish the ref gave him a chance to gain it back. A good example of this was the Mike Swick match when Mike swick hit his guy and he went down. The ref came over, but it was not until Swick got a few more undefended shots in before he called it.
I was impressed with Nathan Marquardt(sp?)
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Post by pikemojo on Aug 8, 2005 0:27:10 GMT -5
Quarry's opponent dropped his hands when he was on the ground and I think that that is what the ref saw and that is what caused him to call the fight. The refs have to be very careful to not let the fighters take too many undefended shots because it can cause some serious damage. If you have seen some of the old UFC events then you will see some really painful, hard to watch undefended head shots.
the Marquadt fight was great. Even though the crowd was booing. The two of them were so evenly matched.
Overall I thought it was a great event. I had Tivoed it and watched it with a friend who had never seen a UFC event and I got him hooked.
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Post by Darth Turkish on Aug 8, 2005 9:05:36 GMT -5
Quarry's opponent dropped his hands when he was on the ground and I think that that is what the ref saw and that is what caused him to call the fight. The refs have to be very careful to not let the fighters take too many undefended shots because it can cause some serious damage. If you have seen some of the old UFC events then you will see some really painful, hard to watch undefended head shots. You are totally correct, I really just wish that the ref had let it go a few more seconds is all. I have seen many people get rocked like that and come back to contionue to fight. I really like Quarry, and I wanted to see him fight a real fight. His match against Lodune Sinclair was like a practice match. |
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Post by Magog1 on Aug 10, 2005 0:17:34 GMT -5
Hay last monday that had a show that show cased Pedro and Randys first fight on spike Tv, did anyone else catch it? I missed the first round.. but from what i saw Padro one (I"m a randy fan so I'm more than cool with the outcome).
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Post by Nemecys X on Aug 10, 2005 8:54:41 GMT -5
I ended up taping it ( and strangely enough ff'ed through nearly the entire RAW to watch it).
Coutre destroyed Pedro in the first round, and it almost ended early at one point (I can't remember how, but I think it was from a near-KO). Pedro really must've collected himself to unleash that assault on Randy in the 2nd. I don't know why they skipped the third round, since it looked pretty eventful.
I Really liked Liddell/Ortiz. I'm far from an Ortiz fan (for some reaso, I just don't care for certain fighters), so watching Liddell beat the tar out of him was great!
I was thinking of working on a game card for Liddell, but the only problem is, it seems like the only two moves in his arsenal are left hook, right hook. These work great it MMA fights, but not so great on LOW cards.
Jay
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Post by Darth Turkish on Aug 10, 2005 12:27:46 GMT -5
Hay last monday that had a show that show cased Pedro and Randys first fight on spike Tv, did anyone else catch it? I missed the first round.. but from what i saw Padro one (I"m a randy fan so I'm more than cool with the outcome). I loved the look on Couture's face as they announced the winner. He clearly did not expexct to win, and when he did he was like, "Huh? Hey, Okay! " |
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Post by Curt on Aug 10, 2005 16:58:25 GMT -5
I have a Chuck Liddell card in word format if you are interested.
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Post by nelson on Aug 10, 2005 17:54:49 GMT -5
curt,
can you send a copy my way?
thanks,
neil
ps you know my addy
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Post by Curt on Aug 10, 2005 22:28:32 GMT -5
Can you send me an e-mail at
clig76@aol.com so I can just reply? thanks
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Post by MAgog1 on Aug 11, 2005 1:12:06 GMT -5
Hay last monday that had a show that show cased Pedro and Randys first fight on spike Tv, did anyone else catch it? I missed the first round.. but from what i saw Padro one (I"m a randy fan so I'm more than cool with the outcome). I loved the look on Couture's face as they announced the winner. He clearly did not expexct to win, and when he did he was like, "Huh? Hey, Okay! " I thought i was the only one who thought that. Heh pretty humble don't you think? |
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Post by Nemecys X on Aug 11, 2005 4:13:56 GMT -5
Yeah it's not every day you get a winner who's actually surprised by the judges results. Usually he's jumping up and down cheering.
By the way, is it just me or, in UFC, does it seem like the earlier matches on a show or card are better than the later ones? Just a thought.
Jay
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Post by Darth Turkish on Aug 11, 2005 19:56:11 GMT -5
By the way, is it just me or, in UFC, does it seem like the earlier matches on a show or card are better than the later ones? Just a thought. Jay By "better" you mean more action yes. By "better" you mean a higher quality, no. I would much rather watch fifteen minutes of Stephen Bonnar beating Sam Hoger, then thiry seconds of Josh Koshchek beating some guy with because of a rookie mistake any first moth trainee will be taught to avoid. I liked the Salaverry/ Marquadt.a great deal. It did not sell to the average fan, who really likes to see action. Those two competitors were quite venely mathced, as was noted before. It was a bit slow, but more a thinking man's match than a big brawl. |
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Post by Magog1 on Aug 12, 2005 2:37:05 GMT -5
A thinking mans match, heh tut. A really acceptional fight can feature both good action and ring savy. Its why Randy the Natural is the man because he brings both to the table (Blatent bios so sew me). A good example of a fight that offered both strategy and power was carlos the heat versus Matt the tera sera. That match offered good grappeling and good brawling. I don't expect (and can't) hope to see that level of skill in every fight, but it's nice. It's a priveledge, not a right to see a fight that good when it happens.
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Post by Darth Turkish on Aug 12, 2005 9:16:38 GMT -5
I agree Randy is good, no complaints there. I really enjoy submissions more than a flurry of fists (although watching Liddel barrage an opponent is impressive). Of course I can appreciate a well-placed fist or foot.
I think it is a great point that it is a privilege to see a good fight. On Paper, the Salaverry/ Marquadt fight was great. In reality, though, it was a bit stagnant.
I would like to see a rematch between them.
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Post by Tim Dalton on Aug 12, 2005 14:18:32 GMT -5
On the replay, they replaced the Salaverry fight with Kenny Florian's win. It was like deja vu from his fight with Leben. Getting tagged, then BOOM with the big elbow. He opened a nasty two inch gash on Karalexis' nose and they stopped it.
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Post by Magog1 on Aug 13, 2005 23:25:34 GMT -5
I'm getting deja vu reading up on people talking about the purity of a submission fight over a brawl... I sware its like I'm arguing pro wrestlign all over again.
I'm going to say it like this.. when a brawler knocks out a submission expert he won. No one has a right to complain, especaily sence the fight isn't rigged. That's the purity of MMA. The better fighter rises to the top. Sure we would all like to make up exscuses on why our favorite fighters loose everyone once in a while..... but it happens (Unless your Vanderlai Silvia and you take 3 crap fights for every good fight you take, than you can keep for loosing for years). I'm not saying UFC Guys don't do it. I'm sure Tito's done it (see ken shamrock... and yes I know that fight was good on hype alone and was well worth seeing, at least from what i heard). Andra Arlovski last fight was one of those kind of fights that didn't need to happen.
I find brawling more enjoyable. Tim Silvai was more fun to watch than Ricco the Rock, you can't tell me other wise. I enjoyed seeing Don Fyre fight more than Hoyce Gracie.
I'll give you a good example of why a brawler is more entertaining than a submission expert. Tim SIlvai is far more fun to watch than Frank Mir. That's one. How about a pride example? I find Wanderlia Silvai's matches far better than Sakuraba's. That's raw brutality. I'm not saying the Axe murder doens't posses Finasse, but his fights are beat down, the way MMA ought to be. When I see Wanderlai loose I wanna see it happen to a better striker.. (Or Randy Couture.. see I told you i was a bios sob).
I was annoyed when Robbie Lawler and Phil Baroni lost to Evan tanner.. but then a strange thing happened.... I began to respect Evan tanner. In fact after his lose I still do. I'm kinda glad the way he went out was to in fact a savage beating. Against a real athlete it takes time and patients (and sometimes in CHuck versuses Randy.. it takes alot less time). Sure I wanted to whine to.. not so much about the winner of the fight (B.S) but how short the fight was by knock out. Theres alot people who enjoy seeing a grappler getting stuck when he's trying to slow down the pace. It happened to Matt linkin against the soul assain (Not that I dislike Matt the law linlin, he is team quest after all).
Every striker fight doesn't have to take 3 or 4 rounds of a brutal A$$ kicking to prove the piont its not an upset against the submission expert. If it did there would be alot more brain damage in MMA.
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Post by Magog1 on Aug 14, 2005 22:11:52 GMT -5
Just caught a replay of the Chuck, Jermy Horn fight on tv. I think an espn channel or something. Now this is kinda of my piont...i find Jermy horns ground game less than thrilling. There were a few good shoots here and there and after seeing the fight I feel less than hyped (I cought the last part of the fight... I Gotta stop doing that) about seeing the rematch. Still there's planty of good fights on the up comming card, but I'm expecting Jermey fight to be a slow tedios.."I'll take him down and hold him" farce.
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Post by Darth Turkish on Aug 14, 2005 23:19:49 GMT -5
I do not think the issue raised was a difference between striking and grappling. Both have their place in one of these contests. I also do not like to see two guys laying around on the ground, hugging each other for very long. It is rarely that you see a successful submission other than a sleeper choke nowadays. (And my goodness, if I hear Joe Rogan exclaim, "He has a Kimura!" again, someone, preferrably Rogan, will die....).
The flurry of blows comment was directed at the undercard fighters who generally are either hybrid fighters or mainly grapplers with limited striking training and use aggression and a flurry as their main striking offense. There is no real picking and choosing of spots, finding and creating openings. Again, a valid strategy as it has proven effective, but in a case like Liddell, he picks and chooses his spots and only unleasehes a barrage when he has his opponent in a defensive position. It is more of an experinece thing, IMO.
To sum up, I like more of a technical fight, whether striking or grappling; more than the type of fight I could see walking down to the nearest college campus bar strip.
But those type of "Slobberknockers" (thanks, J.R.) are good sometimes, too.
As for Horn/Liddell, I think it will be very good. Will Horn shoot and try to get in on Chuck? Sure, it is his bread and butter. I think Chuck is smart enough to not try to grapple with Horn at all. He is also able to sprawl well and I have seen him extricate himself from several grappling positions against good grapplers (Randy), and return to stand up. The question is: Will Horn be able to get him in the short amount of time they do clinch? Plus it is important to note that the ref cannot make the fighters assume a clinch or grappling situation, but can break them apart and make them fight stand up. A big plus for Chuck.
One unknown is Horn's striking. He is apparently not bad at it, but can he trade blows with Chuck, something not many have done successfully? Chuck likes to stay outside and dart in quickly, much like a fencer. It will be hard for Horn to get in one of his elbow strikes. Another Unknown is conditioning: How will they fare in later round when Chuck's arms are getting tried from ten or fifteen minutes of throwing heavy handed punches? How will horn be after absorbing them?
I see the match going to Chuck. Either a round two KO or decision based on action. I would like to see Horn win, but I think the Iceman will be too much for Horn.
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Post by Magog1 on Aug 16, 2005 2:34:01 GMT -5
"But those type of "Slobberknockers" (thanks, J.R.) are good sometimes, too"
Now i'm not picking a fight or anything, and I like your posts.. but your picking on Joe Rogan and then qoute JR? Have you no shame. I'll take a dozen Joe Rogan's to old hill billy boy (is so horribly burnt out on wrestling, heh sorry).
I agree with wanting to see Horn win but that's because much like Duce I'm in a rush rush mood to get the belt away from Chuck. In all honestly I'd like to see some one else win the belt of Chuck than Jeremy Horn. I'm not a big Tito fan, but if he came back and won it, that would open up alot windows for main events. It's a shame VItor's gone, as well nor where near being on his game enough to challenge Chuck either. I'd like to see some competitors like Franklen move up (or down) to face Liddel accordingly. I mean if jermy horn wins the belt besides ta fight with Randy.. I don't really see anyone all that interesting lining up to fight him.
Liddel is the perfect person right now to have these matches, he's not shy about who he challenges, and from what I gather from alot Duces posts I can see he's actively looking for fights. It's easy to hate Chuck Liddel at times but right now he's what the UFC needs. I'd rather see some one new dethrone Chuck than some one Old school (I could live with Randy doing it lol don't get me wrong). I'm not saying some kid from one of the shows.. but what if Ninja from pride came over and did it? Now that would shake things up a bit.
Oh did you consider Robie Lawler Versus Nick Daiz a brawl, or a technical? I think Diaz goading him seemed pretty intellegent to me.
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IPPON!!