Don Imus

[Trent Lawless]

All right, anyone in America with a radio or TV lately has now heard the infamous phrase "nappy-headed [garden implements, to be kind]" uttered by so-called shock jock Don Imus, and we all know that he's been canned from both his CBS radio and MSNBC TV gigs. But assuming this were a few days ago and you didn't know what the future held, what would you believe to be an appropriate punishment for his comments, if anything?

My own vote goes to suspension but keep the shows, but I'll hold off on my reasoning to see what others think.

Bear in mind that I'm not asking this question to set off a flame war; I'm genuinely interested in what a group of my peers thinks about this issue without anyone accusing anyone else of being wrong. The media circus around this has blurred my idea of what the average American thinks about this, so I'm seeking clarity. So please folks, let's keep this civil, for our friendly neighborhood moderator's sake. M'kay?

[gatekeeper]

I think he should've been taken off of TV permanently, but left on the radio.

He's a shock radio DJ who has said MANY things off this ilk and nobody fussed like this.

A guy on Detroit radio said that he heard one of the Rutgers b-ball players say this was the worst thing that's happened to her. He said, "If the worst thing in your life was that you were called a (garden implement) you've had a damn good life! I thought that was funny.

It was wrong to say what he said but I think the real story should be the Duke lacrosse players - which has been buried by a 3-word phrase uttered by an idiot.

I don't get this country sometimes.

[Barnestormer]

Like I told one of my co-workers a couple of days ago, even though what he said was wrong, I don't think that it was something to get fired over. For all we know, it may have been just a one-time "slip of the tongue." I think that CBS should've fined him, say, $500,000 and then turned around and donated the money in Imus' name to the Rutgers general scholarship fund.

[Tournament Master]

If sponsors hadn't dropped him, he wouldn't have been let go. He probably could have been kept on the radio, but he was gone from TV once the major sponsors dropped out. He'll be back on the airwaves in about 6 months, as his fan base will still be there and new sponsors will be found.

[steelthunder814]

Don Imus has had a history of using racial slurs in his program why he was let go now was a simple case of economics...the network was losing sponsors so there u have it. It's not a matter of principle its a matter of the dinero....look for Imus on Satellite Radio next yr!!!

[Pete Beck]

Imus is an idiot...he tried too hard to be "hip" when he should have just said nothing. The loss of sponsor money did him in, but he'll be back, on satellite radio where he can say whatever he wants...i still won't listen to him. Opie and Anthony did the same thing...kicked of the air and ended up on XM, and even though i subscribe i don't tune into their show...much better stuff in the 200 + channels to choose from.

On a tangent from this, when will we see the two Reverends get "fired" from their profit making activities for the comments they made concerning the Duke Lacrosse players...that would be NEVER.

Gotta love the doubel-standard...

[Joe]

Don Imus is an idiot who has made a lot of money by pandering to a frustrated, bigoted, out of touch market. The idea that this was a "slip of the tongue" as was suggested in an earlier post is laughable.

A year ago, when Gonzaga got bounced from the tournament and Adam Morrison lay broken in the floor, college basketball was again the topic of conversation on Imus' MSNBC simulcast. He defended Morrison, who was being made the but of jokes for his understandably emotional breakdown, by saying he would rather see the display of passion by Morrison than the nonchalant attitudes of the "knuckle-dragging, pimp-walking, bottle-popping" players of the NBA.

Not one white person at CBS, MSNBC, or any other media outlet expressed any offense at the comment. Perhaps no one was listening to that show, but more than likely it was simply that the National Association of Black Journalists did not intervene and inform them that was a racist statement.

It is pathetic that right-wing talking heads have decided that since Imus is getting canned for calling a group of Black women "Nappy-headed hos," NBC Universal, which owns the Universal music group, needs to drop people like 50 Cent and G Unit. It is important to note, in comparing apples to apples, I don't recall hearing the term "nappy-headed hos" on any rap album.

To delve a little deeper, the Imus situation is in no way similar to, for example the most famous "Ho" song in rap history, Snoop Dogg's "Bitchez ain't sh-t."

First, Imus is a member of the National Broadcasting Hall of Fame and a radio host carried on public airwaves by news media outlets. Snoop is a musician who made a song that was never played on the radio.

Second, and most importantly, Snoop weaved a two-verse story about a guy who is locked up, and while away, his girlfriend starts sleeping with his cousin, which draws him to the conclusion that "Bitchez ain't sh-t but hos and tricks." Imus, on the other hand, went on a publicly broadcast program and specifically called college-educated women Essence Carson, Kia Vaughn and other "nappy-headed hos." In summary, Snoop told a story in a song that may or may not have been true
about a nameless, faceless female while Imus showed a video of Vaughn and her teammates on the floor and referred to them as "nappy-headed hoes."

The sad thing in all this is that it, yet again proves, that the majority of White Americans still often need someone to tell them that a person is a racist or a bigot for before they realize it. Imus has been doing this type of the thing for years, but only when he is called out by Black members of the media do people say, "That guy is a racist."

Don Imus should have been fired from his post. I am a firm believer of free speech and the first Amendment. Don Imus has every right to call Essence Carson a nappy-headed ho if he feels that way about her. At the same time, MSNBC has every right to tell him to say it somewhere other than on their network.

[mikefortune]

I remember around 1990 and I was watching the NCAA march madness tourney and Bo Kimble fell hard to the floor and when it looked like he would be down for the count, he got back up and played. Dick Vitale said about Bo Kimble that was that "He is one tough monkey". The NAACP went up in arms about his comment and Bo Kimble said that if Dick Vitale call me a tough monkey that was a compliment, and the whole racial argument was ended.

I have seen an interview with Ole and Gene Anderson talking about Brickhouse Brown and Big Red and Ole said "Boy where I come from we don't even talk to your kind let alone wrestle your kind" And I was thinking wow Minnesota must be full of rednecks.

On the Piper DVD you can see Orndorff acting like a monkey making fum of Mr.T.

So dumb people will always be out there and in this day and age of PC it has become more and more prevalent. I also think some people are at times taking things just a little to far. If Imus was Black and he made fun of the "easy blond bimbos" on the bench would we be hearing about.

Being a white male from Canada I may have a different opinion on how things are in the U.S.. Are people in general becoming too sensitive to the world around them and is that a good thing.

[mft]

bows to Mike Fortune

[Joe]

mikefortune said:

I remember around 1990 and I was watching the NCAA march madness tourney and Bo Kimble fell hard to the floor and when it looked like he would be down for the count, he got back up and played. Richard Vitale said about Bo Kimble that was that "He is one tough monkey". The NAACP went up in arms about his comment and Bo Kimble said that if Richard Vitale call me a tough monkey that was a compliment, and the whole racial argument was ended.

I have seen an interview with Ole and Gene Anderson talking about Brickhouse Brown and Big Red and Ole said "Boy where I come from we don't even talk to your kind let alone wrestle your kind" And I was thinking wow Minnesota must be full of rednecks.

On the Piper DVD you can see Orndorff acting like a monkey making fum of Mr.T.

So dumb people will always be out there and in this day and age of PC it has become more and more prevalent. I also think some people are at times taking things just a little to far. If Imus was Black and he made fun of the "easy blond bimbos" on the bench would we be hearing about.

Being a white male from Canada I may have a different opinion on how things are in the U.S.. Are people in general becoming too sensitive to the world around them and is that a good thing.

Some of the things Mike cited, especially the Piper stuff and the Andersons comments, were from such a different era that it is hard to compare then and now. It also happened in the realm of pro wrestling, so that makes it even harder to apply to the Imus discussion.

In all actuality, there is really no precedent for how Imus would be treated if he were Black and made a comment about "blond bimbos." Before anyone jumps in with the P.C. argument, I ask, has anyone heard a Black broadcast journalist carried by a national news media outlet refer to a random white woman as a "blond bimbo." Ho and bimbo are two different things, anyway, but most Black journalists and broadcasters know the lines they can't cross well before they make a statement comparable to the one Imus made.

Finally, I think being a white Canadian would have to make a person see things from a different point of view. Imus' comments brought up many things that a white person from another country, or even this one, may not notice or see as important. For example, after the "Nappy-headed hos" comment, Imus and his producer went on to praise the light-skinned, long-haired Candace Parker for her beauty while contrasting it to some of her dark-skinned, braided-up Rutgers counterparts. This dug into a wound that is nearly as old as racism itself in this country.

I do agree that people in today's United States can tend to be overly sensitive. At the same time, however, comments like those made by Don Imus, both last week and in the past, should not be just brushed aside and those who are offended and upset by them should not just be chalked up as overly sensitive members of the P.C. police.

[Mark 138]

My first thought when this stuff with Imus broke out was, "Imus is still alive?". Seriously, the fact that this relic still had a job in 2007 is amazing to me. I heard that he was pulling a lowly 1 rating in his New York market, which means he was pretty much irrelevant to begin with. Then he said one more stupid thing in a career of idiocy and it became a HUGE deal. Suddenly, this name I hadn't heard in a decade is at the center of the media world again. Sometimes I think the national media LOVES stuff like this because it's a terrific way of getting us to look the other way while REAL news happens. Hey, by the way, who's Anna's babies daddy? What about Sanjaya?

Bottom line-Imus: irrelevant, old guy who should have been gone years ago. What he said: appalling for it's idiocy, but nothing that should've become a national controversy. American public: way over-sensitive. One basketball team got insulted (in this instance) and everyone in the nation takes it personally, even though they weren't the ones specifically referenced. I hope that doesn't mean every time someone insults Tonto on the Lone Ranger (since I have native American/Indian blood) or the horribly offensive Notre Dame Fighting Irishman (since I have Irish roots as well), that I have to go to media war over it. Man, getting offended when someone says something about anyone who happens to fall within the same paint swatch from Sherman Williams as me would get really exhausting.

[Joe]

marktaggart said:

Bottom line-Imus: irrelevant, old guy who should have been gone years ago. What he said: appalling for it's idiocy, but nothing that should've become a national controversy. American public: way over-sensitive. One basketball team got insulted (in this instance) and everyone in the nation takes it personally, even though they weren't the ones specifically referenced.

Actually, I think this was what made the comment so reprehensible in the first place. He took a segment of the population (Black women) who arguably have it harder than any other in the United States, and decided to degrade and insult a specific few of them who did not deserve the treatment Imus gave them.

[Mark 138]

joe said:

marktaggart said:

Bottom line-Imus: irrelevant, old guy who should have been gone years ago. What he said: appalling for it's idiocy, but nothing that should've become a national controversy. American public: way over-sensitive. One basketball team got insulted (in this instance) and everyone in the nation takes it personally, even though they weren't the ones specifically referenced.

Actually, I think this was what made the comment so reprehensible in the first place. He took a segment of the population (Black women) who arguably have it harder than any other in the United States, and decided to degrade and insult a specific few of them who did not deserve the treatment Imus gave them.

But he said it about THOSE WOMEN specifically. He did not say "all black women are...". So, in my mind, it's okay for those women to be horribly mad, upset, offended, whatever. But why do they need some bleeding-heart rushing to their aid like they don't have a voice of their own? I could even see if black women's organizations called for a boycott or firing, or whatever. But let them act like they can speak and form intelligent opinions on their own without the media, or baiters like Jackson and Sharpton, TELLING them they should be mad.

People can talk about empowerment all they want, but if the victem mentality is allowed to continue, that's all anyone will ever be. There are a LOT of black women who can form incredibly insightful thoughts and opinions all on their own, and they are in positions to do so. That's including, but not limited to, one of the highest positions in the national government, and a group of COLLEGE EDUCATED athletes. Let them speak for themselves, that's my feeling.

[Joe]

marktaggart said:

But he said it about THOSE WOMEN specifically. He did not say "all black women are...". So, in my mind, it's okay for those women to be horribly mad, upset, offended, whatever. But why do they need some bleeding-heart rushing to their aid like they don't have a voice of their own? I could even see if black women's organizations called for a boycott or firing, or whatever. But let them act like they can speak and form intelligent opinions on their own without the media, or baiters like Jackson and Sharpton, TELLING them they should be mad.

People can talk about empowerment all they want, but if the victem mentality is allowed to continue, that's all anyone will ever be. There are a LOT of black women who can form incredibly insightful thoughts and opinions all on their own, and they are in positions to do so. That's including, but not limited to, one of the highest positions in the national government, and a group of COLLEGE EDUCATED athletes. Let them speak for themselves, that's my feeling.

Originally, it was National Association of Black Journalists that called for Imus' removal. That is there area, since technically Imus' role fell under the umbrella of broadcast journalism.

As far as those who were insulted doing the legwork and complaining, this country simply doesn't operate like that. Coach Stringer would not have been able to force any kind or repercussions on Imus if she acted without the backing of the NABJ, the considerable amount of clout that Jackson and Sharpton bring to the table or, at the very least, Rutgers University.

I agree that Blacks and other minorities don't need someone telling them when to be offended, and I don't know of any case where a Black person needs an outsider to explain that to them. On the other hand, in most cases, when a minority files a discrimination suit against a white person, it is usually a white person, or group of whites, who gets to decide if any discrimination actually occurred.

[Mark 138]

I'm telling you right now, all that needed to happen was for those women and that coach to call a press conference, say they were offended, and call his sponsors to action, and the problem would've been solved QUICK.

[gatekeeper]

marktaggart said:

But he said it about THOSE WOMEN specifically. He did not say "all black women are...". So, in my mind, it's okay for those women to be horribly mad, upset, offended, whatever. But why do they need some bleeding-heart rushing to their aid like they don't have a voice of their own?

Well, when you make a racial or sexist slur like Imus did, it DOES infer that you think all people of that group, are whatever slur you use.

I know what you're saying but that's how comments like that are viewed.

I'm all for free speech but when you are on a nation wide broadcast, you can't say anything you want. Well, you can but you may be fired for it. Those comments were completely inappropriate and he suffered the consequences.

[Joe]

marktaggart said:

I'm telling you right now, all that needed to happen was for those women and that coach to call a press conference, say they were offended, and call his sponsors to action, and the problem would've been solved QUICK.

We will have to agree to disagree. Don Imus has made a lot of money for a lot years catering to people who don't mind hearing stuff like that. The process of solving the problem would have been a little more difficult than you think.

[mikefortune]

I had not heard of Don Imus before this incident. Then when I saw him I saw a tired looking old man of about 80. I then thought of my wife's grandmother who is from Northern Quebec. She lives in Ontario now and she is the biggest baseball fan I know. I was watching a game with her last summer and Vernon Wells struck out and she uddered the phrase 'damm n#@%*r'. I was shocked, I went to my wife's Mother and told her, her mother uses the N-word. She said yes she's old and until the early 1970's had only seen black people on TV. I went back to Grandma in law and told her she shouldn't use that word any more. And she comes back with that's what they are called, they call each other that. Well after another discussion she said that she would try to cut back but she can't make any promises. I know she probably uses it when she is watching ball by herself but she doesn't use it around me anymore.
What I am getting at is PC is going to take a while, generations in fact. I have wrestled in Tennessee and North/South Carolina Georgia and I know it will take more that a few generations to get it out of the peoples mind set in the south. I also think that Don Imus was wrong for saying that but it is not the first or the last time something like this will happen. A few years ago a golf announcer made a comment about the LPGA and the L stands for Lesbian. Now he made an apology and was slapped on the hand but it does happen in every sport.