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Post by gamtime247 on Jul 15, 2004 9:06:51 GMT -5
Just really wanted to know what people thought about the current state of Tag Team wrestling. Back when I was a kid and watch which was the early and late 80's I saw some of the greatest tag teams in the history of wrestling. I think of teams like The Road Warriors, Midnight Express, Rock n Roll Express, Minnesota Wrecking Crew, Steiners, The Koloffs, Freebirds, Hart Foundation, Bulldogs. I could go on and on with probably about 50 tag teams that hardly even have a comparison to them today besides maybe the Dudleys. I use to live for the Crockett Cup it was my favorite event the NWA threw every year. I just really wondered at what point did writers and script people think tag wrestling was so non-important. I think about those times and even teams that weren't maybe the greatest workers like The Powers of Pain or The Bolsheviks but at least they looked like a team, not just two singles stars thrown together. The only teams I've like over the past 5 years were Edge and Christian, Dudley's, Hardys, Benjamin & Haas and since they were such a great team they split up every one of them at one point or another. Besides those 4 teams not many recent teams can even hold a candle to middle of the pack 80's teams like The Fantastics, Sheepherders, Simpsons, Varsity Club, Doom. Sorry for the rant, I just get frustrated thinking how a lot of the bookers,writers, script people have gotten so far away from stuff that their losing even their most hardcore fans. I know you always look at times from the past with a certain unfair bias but I don't really know if wrestling can rebound anytime soon from what it use to be.
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Post by JimSteel on Jul 15, 2004 9:16:25 GMT -5
Tag Team Wrestling has gone straight to h*ll in the WWE and it doesnt look like its going to get any better
NWA-TNA has good teams as do other feds but for some reason it looks like Vince doesnt care about tag team wrestling anymore
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Post by TheOtherTravis on Jul 15, 2004 9:17:31 GMT -5
They had an article in a recent wrestling mag on this very topic. They mentioned some tag teams from NWA TNA that have started to be identified as really good, true tag teams. Teams such as America's Most Wanted, the Naturals, and several others. I know the WWE is lacking in this department, and I also wish they would get back to true tag teams rather than make shift ones.
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Post by Joe on Jul 15, 2004 13:11:11 GMT -5
Everyone always likes to blame Vince for whatever they find wrong with professional wrestling, but has it ever occurred to anyone that it might not be his fault?
Think about it, maybe the wrestlers themselves have little interest in being locked into tag team action. A perfect example is Shelton Benjamin. While a lot of internet wrestling fans may have sung his praises while he was teamming with Charlie Haas, labeling him as a "solid worker" or "an up-and-coming talent", or whatever other insider term they like to use to impress someone, but the casual fan who rarely visits a wrestling website, watches Raw and Smackdown, and shells out his $34.95 every PPV so he and his buddies can have a good time and a few laughs did not start digging him and saying "Shelton is THE MAN!" until he moved to Mondays and pinned Triple H. Maybe Vince didn't break up The World's Greatest Tag Team, but rather Shelton Benjamin that nixed it.
Judging by the mindset of many of today's pro athletes, it is very likely that top wrestlers consider being a tag team specialist something akin to being second-rate. Edge and Christian were an excellent tag team, but seriously, did anyone see them as being the second coming of the Midnight Express? Face it, most everyone today wants to be Bret Hart of Shawn Michaels, not Jim Neidhart or Marty Jannetty. Give Chris Harris a legitimate chance at being a singles star and see how quick he ditches "Tennessee Cowboy" Jame Storm.
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Post by gamtime247 on Jul 15, 2004 13:55:55 GMT -5
The reason why everything that happens in wrestling is usually blamed on Mcmahon is because he bought up every single other avenue of wrestling in the US over the past 20 years except TNA and a few other independents now. So if your a fan of mainstream wrestling where one of your only main avenues is TV, Mcmahon has to be the guy to blame. It'd be like if people stopped buying Microsoft software, not blaming Bill Gates, and all you have to do is look at buy rates or Tv ratings and you can see people aren't really buying. With the other topic if Vince Mcmahon can handle guys like Bret Hart, Hulk Hogan, and Randy Savage I don't really think a complaining Shelton Benjamin would be enough for him to gut one of the most important divisions in his company. Even if these guys don't want to be young tag wrestlers, Mcmahon use to be a genius at taking guys who were ok singles wrestlers and making them good tag teams. He pushed Demolition and the New Age Outlaws to the moon after James and Gunn struggled as singles, and he didn't really have a singles fit for Eadie and Darsow. I'm sure there has to be some unused singles he could put together for a tag team longer than a month.
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Post by Joe on Jul 16, 2004 10:33:36 GMT -5
If you are going to bring TV ratings and buy-rates into the discussion then it is inaccurate to say people are not buying what McMahon is selling. The fact is, wrestlers are bigger stars that make bigger money than in any time in the history of their profession. Professional wrestlers used to be relegated to smoke-filled clubs and fans of the game were supposed to be ashamed of themselves. Now, pro wrestlers have their own hour-long, prime-time specials that people actually watch and write best-selling books that people actually read. Face it, while Vince may have done some underhanded things in his day, he has also done more good for the wrestling industry than anyone else.
As for the tag wrestling discussion, you hit the nail on the head when you brought up the New Age Outlaws. Bad Ass and Road Dogg were two guys who Vince had no real place for in singles competition. That is how most of the teams that have been built in WWE or WWF have come about. Furthermore, of the three big egos you mentioned that Vince handled, only Hart ever competed in tag action. Savage and Hogan would have never shared the bill with a partner for an extended period of time, and, subsequently, were never forced to.
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Like Watching Paint Dry
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Post by Like Watching Paint Dry on Jul 17, 2004 4:53:47 GMT -5
One of the reasons tag wrestling has faded into oblivion is the payout structure. Tag teams are treated as a single entity, meaning they SPLIT merch sales down the middle. This has always produced headaches where guys would complain (and rightly so since they're making less money).
Basically because of this, a tag team would wind of making LESS than their singles counter part who worked the same position on the card. Even worse, a main event team like The Road Warriors would wind up making less than upper mid card singles stars. It's just not an attractive career path.
So basically besides green kids (like La Resistance) what you'll get at this point is name guys, forming occasional makeshift teams. The exception is a team like The Dudley's, who remain together not because they are an asset, but because they have failed time and again to get over as singles. Without a serious division, The Dudley's themselves become stale beyond belief, which belies the depths of the problem with the tag team situation. It's like a circle of failure.
The talent exists to build quality tag teams. The roster on both brands is filled with guys who are either too small, too green or just flat out lack charisma to make it as singles.
Yet the reality is Vince lacks a desire to invest time & money in pushing it on a creative level, and the wrestlers themselves have little financial incentive to enthusiastically pursue a creative path that will make them less money than if they can hit it big as singles stars.
That's why tag wrestling is at where it is today.
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