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Post by swarm on Nov 11, 2006 0:11:29 GMT -5
ATTENTION: THIS IS NOT AN ATTEMPT TO START A FLAME WAR REGARDLESS OF WHAT SOME MEMPHIS WRESTLING FANS MAY THINK. THIS IS A LEGITIMATE SUBJECT AT HAND, AND A HOT STORY IN THE WORLD OF WRESTLING TODAY. IF YOU ARE A STICK IN THE MUD THEN JUST STAY OUT OF IT AND MIND YOUR OWN BZZZNIUSS. ALL OTHERS...please proceed. Thank you.
Well maybe the story of how Kurt Angle will finally cripple himself isn't such a mystery after all...
sounds like corn-ball lunatic Angle is doing all he can to avenge his humiliation at the hands of the much younger, much stronger Daniel Puder...
ever since Angle became a pill popping drug addict, he sure reminds me a lot of Ken Shamrock...
and we all know what Tito Ortiz did to him...
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Post by gwffantrav on Nov 11, 2006 0:16:01 GMT -5
Swarm, we know you hate TNA, Angle, etc. Everyone gets it...really. You say it in every post, whether it be in the WWE or TNA or whatever threads. And you want to see Kurt Angle die as well...
And don't think it's picking on you...it's really not. It's just old starting the flame wars on the TNA boards...
If you discussion was legit...you would leave out the corn ball, pill popping drug addict stuff...
Maybe the other mods will open it up when they get on the boards...they are free to, it really won't hurt my feelings if they feel the need to have this discussed (Angle vs Puder).
Stick it in the indies where it will be a MMA match if anything
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Post by gwffantrav on Nov 11, 2006 0:19:32 GMT -5
For the record, this is now in the indies section since, while Kurt Angle is a TNA wrestler, this match up is talked about more in MMA circles.
I think that is fair Rob
Edit: This was my mistake..I meant the UFC/MMA thread. My brain was asleep...
My apologies Rob
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Post by swarm on Nov 11, 2006 0:29:19 GMT -5
It belongs in the TNA forum because Angle is a TNA wrestler, and TNA is talking about booking it...
you need to research wrestling past 1975 and see that this is a huge topic all over the net right now...
wrestling observer has a poll and a complete article about it right now on their site...
you can't just run around like deputy dog and lock, and move, and move again someone's threads because that person is smart and awesome...
now please, leave my thread bee.
Puder rules.
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Post by gwffantrav on Nov 11, 2006 0:32:04 GMT -5
It belongs in the TNA forum because Angle is a TNA wrestler, and TNA is talking about booking it... you need to research wrestling past 1975 and see that this is a huge topic all over the net right now... wrestling observer has a poll and a complete article about it right now on their site... you can't just run around like deputy dog and lock, and move, and move again someone's threads because that person is smart and awesome... now please, leave my thread bee. Puder rules. Yes, you are awesome and stuff....and yes, I'm a hick deputy dog...we get all that... But until it shows up in TNA... |
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Post by gwffantrav on Nov 11, 2006 0:34:55 GMT -5
It belongs in the TNA forum because Angle is a TNA wrestler, and TNA is talking about booking it... you need to research wrestling past 1975 and see that this is a huge topic all over the net right now... wrestling observer has a poll and a complete article about it right now on their site... you can't just run around like deputy dog and lock, and move, and move again someone's threads because that person is smart and awesome... now please, leave my thread bee. Puder rules. Yes, Kurt Angle is a TNA wrestler, but his contract states he is also able to compete in some MMA matches...so.... technically this belongs here now |
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Post by swarm on Nov 11, 2006 0:38:47 GMT -5
it's fine.
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Post by gwffantrav on Nov 11, 2006 2:02:21 GMT -5
Thanks for playing nice..I hope you understand my reasoning. I greatly appreciate it |
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Post by BDS on Nov 11, 2006 6:33:26 GMT -5
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Post by LWPD on Nov 11, 2006 7:47:24 GMT -5
Puder/Angle Tough Enough Segment 11/04/04
tinyurl.com/y4xod6This was from Smackdown during the 2004 Tough Enough event. To give this context: * For 20 minutes beforehand all of the Tough Enough kids were forced to eat pasta...and then do running drills immediately after...badly depleting their energy. * Without rest these kids were then brought into the ring and forced to do a squat thrust 'last man standing' drill...which Puder won legit...but once they reached the final two the ref was told by John Laurinaitis to eliminate 'the blond haired kid' and he picked the wrong blond. The audience booed this sensing the fix was in. In reality it was just a mistake. * From there Kurt Angle cuts a Drill Sgt. type promo challenging the winner of the squat thrust comp to a weird quasi shoot wrestling drill. The winner was completely blown up and Kurt wound up manhandling him and in the process broke his ribs. After making short work of the winner Kurt then challenged anyone else in the group to step up. Only one man raised his hand...that man was Daniel Puder. * It later came out that Puder asked the agents beforehand that if in the event he was picked if he could apply a submission...and he was given the 'ok'...the guys backstage wound up overestimating Kurt's advantage because of the built in handicap of the TE kids being beaten down with the prior drills...in reality Kurt's body was in no condition to compete in a public forum against a younger trained motivated MMA fighter...he was physically out of his league. * Puder showed good take-down defense...locking in a textbook standing Kimura before dropping to half guard. That isn't too difficult to do against someone who isn't expecting it and who doesn't have a knowledge of submission defense...even when the opponent was once an Olympic Gold Medalist in Free Style Wrestling. Kurt had no expectation of possibly being in a position where his shoulder joint would be broken when he agreed to do the segment...he was only saved from severe injury due to the ref doing the quick count while Puder's shoulders weren't even down...and Puder not being given the time to crank completely. * Kurt has never given Puder any credit for his performance that night. He's just made excuses and downplayed Dan's efforts. While one can excuse Kurt's refusing to shake Dan's hand during the in ring television segment in the guise of protecting his character...his continued dismissal of Puder's performance shows a complete lack of class and a bit of denial. * For those without the knowledge of having 'grappling eyes'...which is the vast majority of the WWE viewing audience...the commentary of Taz and Michael Cole easily masks what went on here. Had the segment not ended with the 'quick pin'...Kurt would have not only been injuried...but visually exposed...and the segment probably wouldn't have ever seen the light of day. Dan Puder showed no fear...going through a stacked deck of a timed pasta eating/running relay drill...immediately followed by an exhaustive squat thrust competition...and then still went on to hold his own and nearly break the shoulder of Kurt Angle. He has earned his props...and I don't blame him for self promoting the incident.
LWPD (for those looking to gain a comprehensive understanding of the mechanics of the Kimura Lock I'd strongly recommend this extensive Kimura instructional which is archived in the MMA Streaming Links Library)
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Post by Chad Olson on Nov 11, 2006 8:52:26 GMT -5
Puder was a guest on Wrestling Observer Live a couple of weeks ago and had some interesting comments. (You can download the Podcasts off of I-Tunes, sorry, but I don't remember the date).
He said that he's had offers from at least 3 promotions for a match with Angle. He also mentioned that Angle said he could beat Puder with one hand behind his back. He said that comment proves Angle has to be on drugs!
There's a couple of problems with promoting this match. Dana White doesn't really want to promote a match with two pro wrestlers. Also, it would be harder to hype this match up because you wouldn't have access to any footage of this incident.
Whatever happens, it's certainly interesting to hear the banter between the two.
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Post by Chris Ingersoll on Nov 11, 2006 9:29:50 GMT -5
Question: was Puder released by WWE and I missed/forgot it? He was the winner of the last TE competition, right? I just assumed he's been in OVW since then.
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Post by LWPD on Nov 11, 2006 10:04:56 GMT -5
Question: was Puder released by WWE and I missed/forgot it? He was the winner of the last TE competition, right? I just assumed he's been in OVW since then. Puder won the 4 year 'Million Dollar Tough Enough' but in the fine print only the first $250k was guaranteed over the course of the first year. The rest was optional. When the second year hit Puder was only offered a standard OVW developmental contract. So the pay went from $5k a week to $750. He wasn't released...he just quit. Heyman was booking at that point and was high on him but the decision was made from the top. While he wasn't worth the money...this was a clear bait and switch pulled on the public at large. It's understandable that VKM dropped the Tough Enough concept focused exclusively on the men because it's a money trap. Male wrestlers are already a dime a dozen. Trying to find a 'needle in the haystack' out of guys with no real track record at that type of price is ridiculous on it's face. It delivered in ratings but was a needless cost thereafter. The annual Diva Search is just the opposite...where the girls deliver ratings and sell merch on a level that far outweighs the money invested in them. In practice girls like Candace and Maria who 'didn't win' yet are negotiated into less costly deals than the top prize winner actually turn out to be the best return on investment. Daniel Puder Interview...runs ten minutes
LWPD (Puder is a young kid who seems to have a good head on his shoulders...he's spent his time promoting his gym...recently fought and won in Strikeforce and does other gigs that use the benefit of his name value) |
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Post by Chris Ingersoll on Nov 11, 2006 10:37:18 GMT -5
He wasn't released...he just quit. That's what I was missing; thanks. |
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Post by PureHatred on Nov 12, 2006 1:19:10 GMT -5
Here are my thoughts on al this:
--If this were done in a real MMA fed, Puder would KILL Kurt
--If this were done for a pro wrestling company (TNA, for example) I think it would be a dumb move because you'd be signing Puder to work a program based on an incident that occurred in another company; you can't use the footage and you can't even REALLY talk about it.
And once the prgram is over, what do you do with Puder?
--It's fine that Puder is hyping this up to promote himself and I hope he does well in the MMA world, but really, it's all a little pointless. Both men are just better off moving on.
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Post by habbalah on Nov 12, 2006 2:23:11 GMT -5
Blah Pro wrestling fanatism... (Remembers there was a time I acted that way and feels great shame).
In any case I'd be glad to see kurt fight Puder. It would sell tickets. and if I'm really lucky it would sell uncle Dana tickets.
I think it's a great chance to make money. It's also a huge chance for mma or pro wrestling to become... embarrassed by the other. Surely it would really be humbling to see a can from mma beat down Kurt. On the other hand if Kurt did win (at least as far as the net goes) we’d never hear the end of this matter from die hard wrestling fans. It could open a lot of doors, good and bad.
MMA is growing and with growth comes mistakes. Let us stumble forward together.
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Post by JED-SE on Nov 13, 2006 18:13:31 GMT -5
I don't think one losing to the other "embarrasses" MMA or prowrestling. I think only Kurt or Puder embarresses themselves because of how much talking has been done..
I will say this much about Puder and Angle. There's no doubt the Puder is a tough dude, but Angle's an olympic gold medalist. When I use to wrestle, I knew state champions with no other martial art experience who know how break people's limbs. I'm not saying I would bet all of my chips on Angle over Puder, but what I am saying is not to sell Kurt short.
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Post by habbalah on Nov 15, 2006 18:54:23 GMT -5
Well in MMA if Puder won (let assume the ufc) would be able to hype the hell out of the kid to fans. Angle is a huge name (maybe not in mma but fans would know who he was) and they would be able to make a new star. He's a heavy weight so he might get a title shot almost immediatly thus (sorry for the use of mma math) Allow Tim S. to say he's better than Kurt with out ever fighting him. He would, he's Tim.
Now if Kurt won hell they could basically do what ever and the tickets would sell.
I'd be kinda ammused to see Kurt prove every mma know it all wrong agian and again.
You know if he did they responce back would be "Well he's only able to do that because the ufc sucks!"
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